The Defenders-only Discussion Post!

[ddk_mod]

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The Defenders Prompt Post

Talk about the Defenders! Speculate, discuss, squee and debate. There's a thread for each episode so you can discuss what you've watched so far without being spoiled for future episodes - click on top level view to see only the first comment in each thread and stay spoiler-free.

Anon commenting is not mandatory for this post. Playing nice is always mandatory.

Comments

Pre-Watch Discussion

[(Anonymous)]

Talk about hopes, thoughts, speculation and trailers here. Please no spoilers from the actual show!

Re: Pre-Watch Discussion

[ddk_mod]

Trailers!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4h3m7B4v6Zc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D_6J9BqgonU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvyv2Scr9SU

Episode 1 Discussion

[(Anonymous)]

Talk about things that happened in episode 1. Please no spoilers for future episodes!

Re: Episode 1 Discussion

[(Anonymous)]

It was so nice to be reminded that Matt is a kick-ass lawyer! Him doing all the pro-bono work kind of broke my heart because where is he getting his money to live? How is he supporting himself if he's basically working for people who can't pay him?

Episode 2 Discussion

[(Anonymous)]

Talk about things that happened in episode 2. Please no spoilers for future episodes!

Re: Episode 2 Discussion

[(Anonymous)]

Foggy being so insistent on Matt not being Daredevil is gonna make a certain segment of the fandom very angry, I suspect.

Episode 3 Discussion

[(Anonymous)]

Talk about things that happened in episode 3. Please no spoilers for future episodes!

Re: Episode 3 Discussion

[(Anonymous)]

Damn, watching Luke tell Danny off is so satisfying. And the look on Colleen's face after is a look of "Yeah, that's accurate but I'm working on it..."

Episode 4 Discussion

[(Anonymous)]

Talk about things that happened in episode 4. Please no spoilers for future episodes!

Episode 5 Discussion

[(Anonymous)]

Talk about things that happened in episode 5. Please no spoilers for future episodes!

Re: Episode 5 Discussion

[(Anonymous)]

Am I the only one still super confused?

Like... why did that earthquake happen? What is Alexandria's actual plan? What the fuck is the Black Sky (still) besides just Elektra only she can fight a bit better? So much talking and expositing and I still feel like we don't know anything...

Episode 6 Discussion

[(Anonymous)]

Talk about things that happened in episode 6. Please no spoilers for future episodes!

Re: Episode 6 Discussion

[(Anonymous)]

Is it bad that I wish Jessica had have punched Danny into unconsciousness earlier.

He's definitely characterized better here than in his own show, but he's still smarter and a better fighter when unconscious.

Episode 7 Discussion

[(Anonymous)]

Talk about things that happened in episode 7. Please no spoilers for the last episode!

Re: Episode 7 Discussion

[(Anonymous)]

I don't remember if it happened in this episode precisely, but Matt telling Karen to suck it was a highlight of the show for me.

Episode 8 Discussion

[(Anonymous)]

Talk about things that happened in episode 8. Spoilers for all!

Re: Episode 8 Discussion

[(Anonymous)]

Taking Claire to a warzone was the dumbest thing in the world. I feel like the only reason they chopped off Misty's arm was to justify her being there.

Whole season discussion

[(Anonymous)]

Talk about everything!

Re: Whole season discussion

[(Anonymous)]

Holy fuck! That ending was a total doozie! I hope it's gonna spawn ALL THE FAN FICTIONS! I can't wait for Daredevil season 3.

[ddk_mod]

Feel free to make your own threads after this! And anyone scrolling through top-level view - beware, possible spoilers beyond this point.

Needed more angst

[(Anonymous)]

Anyone else think Matt didn't really seem surprised or distraught enough to learn that Elektra was back from the dead?

The crazy lover that died in his arms, super angst times, there she is, BACK, a zombie maybe--who knows, walking around, trying to kill him. It's a pretty big emotional deal! Right? But he's just like " Elektra!" Like "I thought you were on another continent, gosh, guess you're back early?"

I guess I was ruined by fic. This great one from the Defenders Big Bang http://archiveofourown.org/works/11719161/chapters/26397132 (mm8 & ScreechTheMighty's this world is after me (after you)) had a reference to a past scene where Matt was hysterically digging up Elektra's grave, to confirm her body wasn't there, to prove it to himself even though he knew. That seemed very Matt and fitting to the emotions of the storyline. I expected something on that level of emotions. Nope.

I think I see what Charlie Cox meant in an interview where he said that the tone of the Defenders was a little bit lighter than Daredevil. It was strangely not very dark (until ep. 8), considering the subject matter. Kind of more comic-book, less gritty-real-life. I'm okay with that... But I do like angst.

The color coding

[(Anonymous)]

Who else early on saw a new scene with like, blue lights and insta-guessed it was gonna be Jessica? There's even one scene where theyre talking in a circle and the lighting behind each one of em matched. That was so great

Would make a pretty lethal drinking game

Re: The color coding

[(Anonymous)]

Yeah, teh cuts int he scenes matches the person they are going to

Theory time: Madame Gao saved both Matt and Elektra

[(Anonymous)]

The only way i can see them surviving is that our dear loveable villain Madame Gao somehow summoned incredible power and could get trough the rubble and she brough teh Black Sky and Matt with ehr casue who cares, she might ask for soemthing later, right?

Re: Theory time: Madame Gao saved both Matt and Elektra

[(Anonymous)]

Considering Matt appears to be somewhere safe and personal (his orphanage????) I was thinking it was Elektra.
Or there really was a gate to kunlun amd they went through thataway

I just realized something so dumb...

[(Anonymous)]

After all this time... two seasons of Daredevil and the whole of Defenders... we still don't know what the fuck the Black Sky is, do we?

Like... the Black Sky = Elektra but she fan fight a little better and faster?

They don't state she has some kind of demon in her. We don't really get what the hell her importance to Alexandra is or what she is supposed to be able to do that the other five fingers of the Hand can't... and based on that kid Stick killed, there could be multiple Black Skies I guess?

I mean... Alexandra I think refers to a prophecy but it is the vaguest bullshit ever. Prophecy of what??????

How fucking stupid is that.

Re: I just realized something so dumb...

[(Anonymous)]

I don't think the writers know what the black sky is either. They just figured it had a cool name and sounded kinda evil, so yeah, let's make that one of our main characters.

Daredevil Horns appreciation

[(Anonymous)]

theres so much hate for his little ears horns in this fandom. can we just appreciate how adorable they are please ?

Re: Daredevil Horns appreciation

[(Anonymous)]

Looks liek they went to reddit and read the things that made teh fandom itch and just took em and made it a joke... I loved it

Fisk probably knows Matt is DD now for sure

[(Anonymous)]

Right. Right??

Anyone at that station puts two and two togetehr and solves who DD is. Hell. Fisk probably still has someone working in the police and informed him about those two friends the blind lawyer brought.

Re: Fisk probably knows Matt is DD now for sure

[(Anonymous)]

He seemed to know at the end of s2. Or at least like he was about to figure it out. He was definitely gearing up to investigate Matt Murdock all the way back to grade school, so I figure he found out by now.

Matt isn't actually very good at keeping his record clean or hiding things from people who are actively looking for his secrets.

Short-haired Foggy

[(Anonymous)]

This one's for the people who love Foggy. The short hair. To my surprise, he's actually... Really cute that way? Is this blasphemy?

Re: Short-haired Foggy

[(Anonymous)]

Short haired Foggy makes him look more serious. I liked it.

Netflix MCU and the Sokovia Accords

[(Anonymous)]

So I think it's confirmed now that Netflix MCU does (also) ignore the Sokovia Accords and superhuman registration.

Like when in Def 1.07 they said about the police keeping the protags, "Last I heard, they still have legal rights.".

Off the top of my head there's already three arguments for the police to lock them up according to the SA:
--Here we have a couple of superhumans clearly engaged in vigilante superhero bullshit, which is technically already illegal by normal law but specifically so by the Sokovia Accords according to CA:Civil War.
--Here we have a couple of superhumans that are not registered, which is mandatory and thus they are not following the law, by the Sokovia Accords according to Agents of Shield.
--Here we have a couple of superhumans, who are no longer covered by habeas corpus, meaning they can be legally arrested and imprisoned indefinitely without reason, cause, or trial, which is part of the curtailing of human and civil rights for superhumans by the Sokovia Accords according to Agents of Shield.

So status in the MCU is: the MCU movies have the Accords but ignore superhuman registration, AOS has both, and Netflix MCU has neither. Which seems like a pretty gross oversight (in both senses of the word) if we are supposed to take the MCU as one universe and not variations. Particularly CA:CW is gross in not mentioning its titular and half the protagonists and countless people losing coverage by civil and human rights.

At least Netflix MCU ignores the whole bullshitshow entirely and leaves it out of their verse instead of grossly half-assing it.

Re: Netflix MCU and the Sokovia Accords

[(Anonymous)]

I have a probably incorrect theory but boy would it make sense, and it's this:

Infinity Wars, being the culmination of everything and with Marvel Studios knowing it can only keep the actors playing the legacy heroes around for so long, ends with literally that universe collapsing as has happened in the comics and a few select heroes suddenly finding themselves on an alternate earth. Spider-Man, the Guardians and a few others are suddenly forced to deal with a world that potentially has a different Iron Man, Cap, etc. operating on it but is similar enough... cue Phase Four being suddenly a whole new ballgame but still with some characters fans love present.

That alternate Earth they end up on? It's the one the Netflix Defenders bave resided in all along. Hence phrases like "the green guy" and "the flag waver" and "The Incident" and the lack of specificity towards the movie universe.

Again, unlikely. But Mark Ruffallo did recently state that "Everybody dies" in Infinity Wars in an interview, which seemed hyperbolic until the cast member with him went white and warned him about his NDA and to shut up.

It also explains Feige's continual shiftiness whenever he is asked the question of the Netflix heroes in particular appearing in the current MCU.

The MCU is building to a climax that the Netflix shows obviously aren't, so...

Who was following Who?

[(Anonymous)]

In episode three we see Jessica looking back and then the camera zoom to Matt a moment later Jessica is behind him and Matt starts running so im confusos. Was Matt following Jessica or it was the other way around?

Re: Who was following Who?

[(Anonymous)]

Matt was following Jessica at first, but Jessica busted him and she ducked into a store or around a corner, and turned the tables so that she was following him instead. The smirk on her face when Matt starts walking faster trying to get away from her is awesome!

Different friendships is the 4 shows

[(Anonymous)]

Thinking abuout the whole Foggy/Karen dont understand Matt and lookign to all the otehr friendsghips in the shows it makes me kind of happy that in DD the acceptance torwards the hero friend is not on the go.

Trish accpeted Jesica since teh begginign and encourage her to help others.

Claire found Luke who she told him he can be more than what he wanted to be and he started helping people.

Collen is a warrior who now has a partner and they can go battling crime

But Matt has ordinary friends. Friends that only see the bad side of his nightly activities. It's a very complex relationship cause these two dotn care if the city falls appart. They just care about his friend.

Also that makes for good tv cause it will be tiring if all those friends on the four shows are so supportive of teir respective loved one.

Now. Who's gonna be Frank's friend or he's a lone wolf?

Re: Different friendships is the 4 shows

[(Anonymous)]

Frank's friend? Micro, probably. And Karen, I hope.

Last scene

[(Anonymous)]

Are they going to drag his dead beat mom into this? Is she somehow mystical? WTF was up with the last scene ?

Like why not take him to a real hospital ?

Re: Last scene

[(Anonymous)]

He was in the suit. Whoever got him out of the explosion or rubble brought him there knowing the will help him no questions asked

Did they forget Trish know how to fight?

[(Anonymous)]

In episode 5 when Jess came for Trish and they are attacked by one Finger, Trish was just on the side looking scared while Jass fought Poorly and then DD comes save her.
Did the producers really forget all the training Trish has had in the past?... I mean really....

Re: Did they forget Trish know how to fight?

[(Anonymous)]

I really liked the show, but there were so many plot holes ;-;

Anon...I think the answer to your question might just be a flat 'yes'.

(frozen comment) To people who watched Iron Fist: A Very Important Question about Danny Rand and education

[(Anonymous)]

I watched some of Iron Fist, mostly the end, and I'm not about to watch the first few episodes/Iron Fist: Businessmen Behaving Incompetently just to figure this out, so can someone please tell me if there's anything at all that even registers the fact that, if Danny went away when he was ten, he didn't go to school past fifth grade? Like...why did they even let him into the company without his having a college education? Or a high school education? Or a middle school education? And is there any explanation for how Danny is somehow past a fifth grade level in reading and math? I mean, maybe they taught some kind of math in K'un Lun (do they show him at some kind of school?), but if they did intensively teach reading...why would it have been in English?

Also, where did he learn to drive? (I know that this one isn't explained.)

I know that you can explain away a lot with He's Really Rich, but come on.

(frozen comment) Re: To people who watched Iron Fist: A Very Important Question about Danny Rand and education

[(Anonymous)]

We all asumef (me included) that the monks tought him how to read and stuff...
Danny was part of the company cause he owns 51% of teh company. Ward told him eh didnt knew anything about the company and he wanted to buy his part of it but Danny said no. In the end he is still part of the company but Ward is the one in charge... Danny comes when he just sees fit...

Iron Fist's punch vs Matt's hearing/equilibrium

[(Anonymous)]

If there's a shockwave every time Danny whips his glowing fist, wouldn't that be like Matt standing next to a pile of exploding TNT? It seems highly directional, but still, for someone with Matt's heightened senses, it seems like something that would affect him when Danny breaks Elektra's sword right next to Matt, more or less above his head.

Re: Iron Fist's punch vs Matt's hearing/equilibrium

[(Anonymous)]

It did. There's a scene where after a punch, Matt is covering his ears and clearly struggling with the sound.

I don't remember which ep. that was, sorry. One of the later ones, I think. (I'm sure someone else will be happy to help you out with that, if you need it.)

Does the fact the kid Luke was trying to help was cleaning up after murder rub anyone else wrong way

[(Anonymous)]

I absolutely loved the scene of Luke calling Danny out but over someone covering a murder seems to be the wrong way to get there. It seems wrong be this poor unfortunate soul had no choice but to cover up murders. Maybe this is because of my own privilege but just share your thoughts on this.

Re: Does the fact the kid Luke was trying to help was cleaning up after murder rub anyone else wrong

[(Anonymous)]

I mean, Luke's point isn't that covering up a murder scene isn't wrong, it's that going after the lowest level of the Hand/ their grunt contractors is stupid, especially when Danny has the privilege and power to go directly after the leadership.