ddk_mod: (defenders)
ddk_mod ([personal profile] ddk_mod) wrote in [community profile] daredevilkink2017-08-15 06:49 pm
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The Defenders-only Discussion Post!

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The Defenders Prompt Post


Talk about the Defenders! Speculate, discuss, squee and debate. There's a thread for each episode so you can discuss what you've watched so far without being spoiled for future episodes - click on top level view to see only the first comment in each thread and stay spoiler-free.

Anon commenting is not mandatory for this post. Playing nice is always mandatory.

What is even happening with Karen

(Anonymous) 2017-09-12 03:58 pm (UTC)(link)
I have to ask, does anybody understand Karen anymore? I see a lot of emotional love and hate postings about her but all the supporting arguments are full of assumptions about her motivations. This isn't like with Matt where we get to see his whole life's story on the show, we know everything that was done to him and we have to suffer alongside him. At least we can understand him because we're told and shown what he's about. But with Karen, we're not told or shown anything. And whatever they have, they keep editing it. Karen's backstory was one thing in Daredevil season 1, they changed it for DD season 2, and now in Defenders it's like she's changed again? Or her choices aren't lining up with what's come before. Idgi. There is no consistency to this character. What are we supposed to do with this?

Re: What is even happening with Karen

(Anonymous) 2017-09-13 01:10 am (UTC)(link)
The thing about Karen is that I honestly feel like she's torn between two wildly different extremes: her attraction or approval of violence/vigilantiism with Frank and Matt, and now in the Defenders she's swung around to firmly being anti-vigilantes for Matt, because she's thinking that it destroyed his life. I mean, in DDS1 she was pro-Daredevil very much, and in S2 she seemed to get enamored with Frank while realizing how fucking dangerous he and Matt are by the end of the season. So she's very mercurial?

Re: What is even happening with Karen

(Anonymous) 2017-09-13 09:43 pm (UTC)(link)
Yeah, I don't think her backstory has much to do with the choices we see on the screen - except for the backstory of what happened in seasons one and two.

I mean let's take stock: she's been framed for murder, survived an assassination attempt, had her life saved by a "masked hero", got tangled in an organised crime investigation, got a friend killed because she couldn't let go, shot a man to death and covered it up, befriended and then cut ties with a known mass murderer, and then found out that one of her closest friends is secretly a vigilante.

If this was my life, I think my worldview and behavior would go through some rapid shifts, too.

Re: What is even happening with Karen

(Anonymous) 2017-09-13 09:59 pm (UTC)(link)
Yeah, but at the same time, it seems much more random because we're not given enough screentime with just her and her own viewpoints and ideas. Hopefully DDS3 will fix that.

Re: What is even happening with Karen

(Anonymous) 2017-09-13 10:59 pm (UTC)(link)
The Defenders were handled terribly as far as character development is concerned.

But I think what's going on in her head is pretty clear and well-grounded in s.2. And in s.1, she was a freshly introduced character, so the expectations for writing are a bit different. I think she was introduced quite well, though.

Re: What is even happening with Karen

(Anonymous) 2017-09-14 08:26 pm (UTC)(link)
Ugh, I hope not. She's already had so much screen time! I'm not watching a comic book show about daredevil to get the trials and tribulations of a secondary character secretary who decided she's a journalist. Frankly I'm tired of her taking up story space that could be better used elsewhere.

Re: What is even happening with Karen

(Anonymous) 2017-09-15 10:05 am (UTC)(link)
(x5 billion please)

Re: What is even happening with Karen

(Anonymous) 2017-09-15 03:43 pm (UTC)(link)
DA.
I have to disagree here. I tend to get tired and bored when a TV show only focuses on the main character so far in DD they did a pretty good job balancing that.

Re: What is even happening with Karen

(Anonymous) 2017-09-15 05:09 pm (UTC)(link)
nayrt

I agree but it depends on the side character. On Karen we'll have to agree to disagree. Last week Geeks of Color called Karen the female Danny Rand, aka Danny Bland, aka why do we have to keep watching this annoying character. The answer is we don't. The writers had their 15 minutes to do something great with Karen and I'm not about spending my life waiting for a character to get good. There're too many other great characters on my tv to waste time stanning Karen Page.

Re: What is even happening with Karen

(Anonymous) 2017-09-17 10:34 am (UTC)(link)
NA

I think she's interesting. Her role in s.2 was one of the highlights of the season - it was so viscerally clear that she's trying to redeem herself in the worst way possible, and you could see her struggling with her past even though the past is never mentioned. I want to see where she'll go next - will Weasley's murder be revealed? Will she try a new approach to guilt? Who would she trust with her darkest secret?

And of course, there's still whatever she's been running from since before she came to new York. We've been getting hints about that from the very beginning. If the writers have done it with a clear idea of her past in mind, it could be done brilliantly. If they decided to "just wing it", it'll probably be done terribly, but I still want to see which one it will be.

All in all, Karen is one of the more dynamic and interesting characters in the show.

Re: What is even happening with Karen

(Anonymous) 2017-09-15 04:31 pm (UTC)(link)
Completely my reaction to Karen now too. It's not that I hate her, it's just that I don't care about her anymore. I used to but somewhere along the way the show has killed any goodwill I had toward her and now I just want to ffwd every time I see her.

Re: What is even happening with Karen

(Anonymous) 2017-09-15 09:50 am (UTC)(link)
I really hope that they will.

Viewpoints and ideas of different characters are what makes this show interesting, and Karen's views on life are all twisted and tangled up... lots and lots to explore.

Re: What is even happening with Karen

(Anonymous) 2017-09-13 02:01 am (UTC)(link)
I find the notion that Karen is suddenly being written very poorly (as opposed to having been written very poorly from episode 1 and people are just now noticing it) very amusing.

Re: What is even happening with Karen

(Anonymous) 2017-09-13 09:29 pm (UTC)(link)
Hm. Okay. What makes you say she was written so poorly from the start? It's been a while since I watched s1 and s2, but from what I remember Karen was dealt with okay.

Re: What is even happening with Karen

(Anonymous) 2017-09-15 02:36 am (UTC)(link)
We have different interpretations of season 1 and 2.