daredevilkink | Discussion/Off-Topic Post #1

I'm the not-OP anon in that thread, and personally I'm cool with it! I'm always in need of more people to flail about Daredevil with. Just a warning that we've been discussing a lot of season-wide (and post-season) spoilers, though.

SAME.

what it says on the tin. suspend all disbelief for a couple seconds and just tell me things you want to happen, things you'd sell your soul to see. however likely or unlikely, if you could write something into the script what would you add??

personally, i'd kill to see every missing scene from nelson vs murdock. i wanna see half-dead matt trying to take a swing at foggy, i wanna see foggy calling claire, i wanna see what went down when claire turned up, i wanna see foggy losing his mind about the whole thing. when it picks up foggy is seething, i want to see foggy's emotional rollercoaster leading up to so-mad-i-could-kill-you (honestly i'd kill to see a four hour all-inclusive extended directors cut of nelson vs murdock, i can't tell you how many times i've watched the matt + foggy parts of that episode)

i'm also a big big big fan of the college flashbacks, i would pay good money to watch a daredevil prequel series that's all about matt and foggy in college.

there are probably a million other things i'm not remembering right now but what about you guys??

wait also two other things i forgot:

1) please burn the red suit and put matt back in his black pyjamas and
2) more totally unwarranted completely gratuitous butt shots matt has a beautoful butt and i think we deserve more of it

o/

Sticking to the old school spoiler space:
.
.
. SPOILER
.
.
. SPOILER
.
.
. SPOILER
.

Marvel has an ace (and all kinds of assholish) PR team, yeah. Right now they're encouraging speculation everywhere but going pretty far to keep anything official, especially pictures, off the internets. They're staaaarving us on purpose gearing up for S2. I kinda admire them but also kinda hate them, and kinda hate myself for admiring them? They're good. Those bastards.

V. D'Onof wasn't on set for the whole time so I'm down for a court appearance (with Vanessa, yesss) or even just scenes of him in prison. You KNOW he's going to find out who killed Wesley. But I know Marvel is hiding his appearance because he's not even on the DD IMDB page as showing up for S2 yet.

The only thing that holds me back on Bullseye appearing is we'd get almost no time for his obsession with Matt to be relevant to the season. I know not everything has to be based on the comics, but their history, omfg (I'm always going to be fond of Lester calling Matt 'little bitch'). The only villain more obsessed with Matt than Fisk is Lester and I'd really want to see that screwed up relationship start and just... evolve, I guess.

But where would they find the time? I know they were calling for Bullseye to be cast (Jason Statham would have been great if he'd not turned down the role) but then they went with Frank Castle instead. And then added Elektra who is apparently going to be manipulating the hell out of Matt in S2 (and Matt used to love Elektra so). There were some set pics that showed Matt and Elektra being chauffeured in what looked like Fisk's old entourage of mobile vehicles. But they freaking brought Stick back for 3 whole episodes and GDI, Stick trained both Elektra and Matt so where the hell does Stick and possibly Stone fit into this season? And where does Foggy and Karen get to have time, or Foggy, I guess, since Karen is kinda supposed to be doing the romance thing with Matt? Does Foggy get any screen time and backstory at all? Idk idk this isn't like S1 where they expected to only have the one season and used half of it to set up The Defenders and Iron Fist. This time it's all Daredevil and there is TOO MUCH, omg. I hope they make it work.

Guys, please help!

I've fallen in love with Waid's run of Daredevil but I have no idea how to buy the real-life paper printed versions. There are like two different types of volumes? And I thought Waid's was volume 3 and 4, but the bookshops list Waid's volumes as 1, 2, 3, 4, ... And I'm trying to get as few individual books as possible, so I don't want to buy a million weekly issues.

I really want to have all of Waid's DD work. I just have no idea what to buy. :'( Can anyone help me out?

Yup. Waid's work is sold in six softcovers, numbered 1-6, and 3 hardcovers (that each contain two of the softcovers.). Are you from the US or...?

.
.
. SPOILER
.
.
. SPOILER
.
.
. SPOILER
.
I wonder if they'll use Fisk's appearance to set up stuff in season 3? Now that I think about it, he has to have more than an off-hand "btw this guy's still in jail" scene or else they wouldn't be keeping it under wraps like that, and in the S1 finale they had Fisk finally become the Kingpin so I'm expecting some pretty magnificent plotting from him. I'm going to die of a heart attack when he finds out who killed Wesley, tho. D:

I'm concerned about the amount of material they're stuffing into S2 too, but thinking about it, S1 would have superficially looked like a lot on paper as well (like, Kingpin + Stick + hints for K'un-Lun + The Hand + Gladiator, on top of what always needs to happen storyline-wise to introduce a new superhero) and they handled everything beautifully. There was still only one major storyline with Fisk vs Matt though, and a lot did get sidelined into vague hints for future seasons, so idk. You definitely have a point about Bullseye, they're gonna be pushed for time and I don't want them to rush that buildup of his scary obsessiveness when there's already so much going on.

We're going to be bombarded with new trailers and stuff this final month-and-a-half, it looks like. I tried to find the trailer release dates for the first season, and they seemed to mostly be out the month (and the fortnight!!) right before the season launch. I'm excited but everything feels so far away ;_;

Oh, that's awesome! And so much easier than I thought. Thank you so much. I can try to get the hardcovers then. Are they the oversized hardcovers? It looks like there are five.

I live in Australia :]

DA: As a fellow Aussie also trying to get Waid's run I can tell you your best bet is to one go to your local comic book shop/book shop (the bigger, the better) where, if you have an idea of what you want, they'll be able to help you order it in. Or even help you find it. But this'll be more pricey than your second option which is to order online at the Book Depository (https://www.bookdepository.com/) where the books will be cheaper and the shipping is free but it'll take anything up to a month to get here.

Also you really have to know what you want on that site but, from memory, I think they have at least all the soft covers of Waid's runs.

Hope that helps!

Yay, hello fellow Aussie! omg, thank you heaps. It didn't even occur to me to go to Book Depository. I love that site so much. I was gonna go scour all 2 comic shops I know, hahah. <3

Hi! You're welcome! I usually go there first because cheap books. And free shipping.

Two?? You're so lucky!!! There's only one in my city and it's about the only one around for ages... the next closest is in Sydney.

Good luck!

Oh, wow! Damn, Australia needs more comic book shops (actually, book shops in general :'( I miss the days of Borders.) Thank god for online shopping.

It really does. (Oh man yes. We've only recently got a book shop back in town - after our Angus and Robertson closed there just wasn't one in town, you went to Sydney or to a place like Big W...). Online shopping has gotten me so many books.

i'm just gonna keep this party going: karaoke!! i need to see college era matt and foggy doing very drunk very bad karaoke

Ouch, that sucks. Big W does not exactly have a great book selection, does it? D: I would've died, probably. Online is great but there's just something different about being able to browse and buy stuff straight away (and not wait for shipping! lol). Glad you have a new shop now.

It really doesn't. Popular books and their cheaper knock offs plus more self help books than one person could possibly read. It does have a different feel, something more solid than online.

We also have a comic book shop now so it's all looking up. =)

Hey,

I was just wondering, this excellent comics recaps tumblr was recently announced here - http://daredevilrecaps.tumblr.com/ (I think one or two of you mods might be the one maintaining it, right?) and was wondering, is this gonna get more content? The idea is perfect, the comments hilarious and the fandom could *really* benefit from the Rosalind storyline being shown and explained. :)

I feel like a total dick for responding to a comment that someone put so much work and thought and love into with just "I'm glad you liked it. Thank you for reading :)"
Then i overthink it and write four drafts of a reply that never gets finished or posted

o/ I'm going to comment a little upthread because we are wordy mofo's *high-five* and I had the chance to watch back to back episodes this weekend. Might take me a couple of days to get back in here, this responsible adult with a job thing sucks.

WRT your reaction to Karen in the comics, omg, yes, I don't even know how people went from watching the show to reading the comics because the characters are... both the same but also pretty different, Karen especially. You avoided the first DD run which is good, very good, because it starts out written by Stan Lee and he's got a great imagination but he writes crack. Sometimes slashy crack but mostly soap opera crack. A lot of it is about how much Karen is in love with Matt, and how Foggy loves Matt but is also jealous of him, particularly over Karen. The weirdly non-existent love triangle (that is kinda visible on the show) is in full effect for SO MANY ISSUES. Karen just wants to love and protect and take care of Matt (because he's hot and blind and if he ever said one encouraging word to her she'd be all over him) but Matt never pays her any attention because he knows Foggy is into her, and also he thinks she deserves someone better, she'd never love Matt anyway, blah blah blah. Karen has a crush on Daredevil, Karen is in love with Matt, but then she finds out Matt is Daredevil and her emotions immediately turn into NO, YOU ARE BLIND, STOP THIS NONSENSE, QUIT RIGHT NOW. The comic is definitely a product of its time and it gets worse before it gets better.

All of this to say that I'm sorry Kevin Smith fridged Karen, but I was relieved to see her out of the picture. I looooved Matt and Natasha Romanoff, they were a good pairing and they were ridiculously badass together, their relationship was more equal, and DD and Elektra were always fun when they were fighting together (hell, they're fun when they're fighting against each other) but I had suuuch hardcore NO feelings about comics Karen. Kudos to the show for getting me past that Karen to embracing the MCU Karen, like massive kudos, it's a miracle.

I will say the whole face-touching thing with Foggy put me off of Karen the first time I saw it, though, and that's one of the things I've never gotten over. Such a dick move, and my heart pretty much broke for Foggy. I can never decide if Karen did it on purpose trying to communicate that she wasn't interested in Foggy or she genuinely was using Foggy to surrogate for Matt? Like, who does that? But it's kinda hard to see that scene is a more positive light and I keep hoping I'm missing something! So if you have an opinion that's different, I'd love to hear it.

Yes, get rid of the red suit. It's horrible.

My second wish is one that should probably go on the unpopular opinions thread, or something: Have Fisk back for an episode or so, but eventually make it clear that he's had a conversion experience in prison and is trying to do the right thing. Because that's something that comic books never seem to do with their villains, and it also has potential, such as rewarding the no-kill rule. (Why, yes, I love Astrocity's Steeljack. And Faith and Spike from Buffy. Why do you ask?)

As one of the people involved (I recapped the 1602 arc), I know that the person recapping the Rosalind stuff is working on it slowly, but just likely distracted.

I personally do plan on going in and continuing to recap more alt-Matt storylines - I've also just had some life stuff going on and some fanfiction-related stuff happening. It's awesome that you like it so much though and I will relay that message!

I HAVE SO MANY THOUGHTS ON THIS!

First off, we will likely get more college flashbacks, because Elektra was Matt's college girlfriend, so the show will have to really flash back to give us the context on that which I am super excited for. Her arc in the comics is one of the few instances there where we do see a lot of college Matt, so I have high hopes.

Second, here is my plausible and complex theory for S2 based on characterization from S1 and certain things in the trailers and images released so far:

In S1, we see one key difference emerge between Matt and Foggy, personality-wise that I suspect (hope) will be the engine that drives S2. Foggy believes that all people are innocent until proven guilty and that even the innocent deserve good representation and support no matter what they did, and his knowledge of all of the men in the bar and their backstories tells you that he is non-judgmental towards the criminally-inclined or hard up and likely feels empathy even for people who make bad choices. Matt is much quicker to judgment and gives anyone who breaks the law absolutely no empathy, likely because he overcame his own tragic backstory to pick himself up by his bootstraps and also his Catholicism. He has a much more absolute view of who is a good person and who isn't and is insistent with Foggy that they only represent people who he deems "innocent".

SO imagine a scenario in S2 where Frank Castle has been in operation in the background even of S1. And either someone Foggy knows directly is killed by Castle in his quest to take the law into his own hands, or someone indirectly who he knows shows up at their office begging the lawyers to help investigate - a wife and child of one of Castle's victims, for instance.

Matt refuses to intervene, because he, not personally having encountered Frank yet, figures that he doesn't have to care about what happens to criminals - they're asking for it and his views are somewhat aligned with Castle's early in the season.

This just adds to the distance between him and Foggy following Nelson v. Murdock, because Foggy has a very different view of how a hero should behave. Foggy starts investigating himself despite Matt's objections, and gets himself involved to the point where maybe Frank even knows who he is and assumes that Nelson and Murdock are a crooked firm involved with the wrong people, defending criminals. Foggy's involvement pulls Matt into conflict with Frank, because Foggy gets Frank's attention and wants to stop him. (Hence why apparently based on set photos one of the scenes shot involved Foggy and Frank together at a warehouse).

Over the course of the season, Matt is forced to confront a different moral dilemma that builds off of his struggles last season - he is very clear that killing a criminal personally is wrong, but what about if it's his own inaction that indirectly leads to death. Should he intervene to prevent the deaths and suffering of those he deems guilty, even if they are not being killed by his hand?

Things with Elektra complicate this further for him because she's also a criminal who kills but he loved her once.

And so both Foggy acting as an external conscience pushing him to confront his beliefs AND Elektra put Matt into a direct conflict with Frank and force him to face what being a hero and symbol means and what his obligations in that respect are. The show still portrays he and Frank as similar in the way it did with he and Fisk, but in a different way, Foggy gets lots to do, Elektra's arc makes sense alongside Frank's, and the show really pushes everyone's arcs forward in a relevant way.

It explains also why Matt is asking Father Lantom in the church "Why do I still feel guilty?" He's referring to feeling guilty about a criminal dying even when he didn't cause the death himself and even when the person was horrible and guilty themselves.

I imagine that his relationship with Karen will play into this because she's also slowly sliding down the slippery slope towards guilt and sin and maybe at the beginning of the season he takes refuge in her because she (unlike Foggy) agrees with his side in things on account of what happened with Wesley.

So yeah... if S2 isn't this, I still think it's the best way to repeat the best elements of S1 but push them further, keep Foggy and Karen central to things while introducing new characters, and bring the pain for Matt (which, lets face it, is really what we all want).

We'll see! But I wanted to share to see what people think of that theory. :D

SO, someone posted an AMA request for Elden Henson. However the Reddit daredevil community hates him. Can we get some upvotes for him?

https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/43pbn2/ama_request_elden_henson/

.
.
. SPOILER
.
.
. SPOILER
.
.
. SPOILER
.

This spoiler space might be a little useless but I'm gonna leave it there anyway.

SEASON 3?! Oh my god, I hadn't even thought of that! I'd kinda like to see Elektra show up and manipulate the ever loving hell out of Matt, dragging him back into her bed, etc, probably right after he's finally okay with flirting with Karen and thinking maybe there's a chance for them. Elektra shaking that up would be par for her course. I'm kinda down with Elektra manipulating Matt into making bad choices for himself and everyone around him, only to find out near the end that she was hired by Kingpin to get him to do exactly that. But my question is does Elektra know Matt is DD, or does she find out during the season?

And you are toootally right that on paper S1 looks like a hot mess, like how would they ever fit everything in there? In hindsight, the biggest problem I have with DD S1 is that they expected to only have one season and used 1/3 of it to set up Iron Fist and The Defenders. The amazing success of S1 and greenlighting a S2 immediately meant some disruption to The Defenders schedule. But if S2 sticks to the world of Matt Murdock and Marvel worries less about using him as a form of exposition for everything else, we should be in for an awesome season, yay!

Discussion/Off-Topic Post #1

Re: Watching Daredevil for the first time and without anywhere to flail

Re: i love matt murdock

if you could write something into the season two script what would it be

Re: if you could write something into the season two script what would it be

Re: DD viewing #2139 and noticing new things

How to buy (printed) comics

Re: How to buy (printed) comics

Re: DD viewing #2139 and noticing new things

Re: How to buy (printed) comics

Re: How to buy (printed) comics

Re: How to buy (printed) comics

Re: How to buy (printed) comics

Re: How to buy (printed) comics

Re: How to buy (printed) comics

Re: if you could write something into the season two script what would it be

Re: How to buy (printed) comics

Re: How to buy (printed) comics

That Daredevil recaps tumbler?

Re: Fics and Comments

Re: DD viewing #2139 and noticing new things

Re: if you could write something into the season two script what would it be

Re: That Daredevil recaps tumbler?

Re: if you could write something into the season two script what would it be

AMA for Elden Henson

Re: DD viewing #2139 and noticing new things